>> A wonderful writer

2
and one of the rare breed of critics

3
who studied dance in order to better write about it,

4
Mr. Walter Terry.

5
>> Thank you.

6
(applause)

7
(laughter)

8
I know, I heard something like,

9
it was either a drumroll for a death knell or a fanfare.

10
I don't know which of those.

11
(laughter)

12
Should I tell them that?
>> No.

13
>> I think, honest to say that Mr. Smith

14
said that it's his stomach because he ate

15
fried potato skin and he's never had one before

16
and it's killing him.

17
So if he leaves precipitously, you'll know why.

18
(light laughter)

19
On this particular panel, we're going to be

20
reviewing and commenting on

21
the American Ballet Theater

22
which came into being in 1939 gave its first

23
performances in 1940 and changed the course of

24
dance and theater history around the world.

25
Its title was not chosen at random because

26
it has always been ballet.

27
It has always been theater.

28
Now let me introduce the panel,

29
well, first of all, I'm not going to begin with the ladies.

30
I've got to begin with the star, Igor Youskevitch.

31
That's why we're here.

32
(applause)

33
And on my left is Ms. Lucia Chase, without whom

34
there would not be an American Ballet Theater.

35
>> Oh, I can't believe that.

36
(applause)

37
And on my right, her prince consort, Oliver Smith.

38
(applause)

39
And on the left, a ballerina with the

40
American Ballet Theater for many years

41
and now she's giving Italy a taste of what contemporary

42
ballet is all about as a director, a choreographer,

43
a restager and a dancer, Sallie Wilson.

44
(applause)

45
And here's the dancer, Leon Danielian,

46
who started out as the little boy of Armenian stock

47
in New York during the depression and in order to make money

48
he danced at Armenian weddings, Catholic weddings,

49
Bar Mitzvahs, Muslim Ramadan, anything like that.

50
And on top of it all, he was able to do entrechat deux

51
which I think the only other person until Wayne Sleep

52
recently was somebody named Dosinski,

53
but there's Leon Danielian.

54
(laughter and applause)

55
I'd like to begin,

56
of course, I have my memories, I would just say one thing.

57
That I began my critical career on the Boston Herald

58
in 1936 and my New York career in 1939

59
with the New York Herald Tribune.

60
And as I mentioned earlier, that was the year that

61
Ballet Theater, now the American Ballet Theater, was born.

62
So, I have always felt very close to that company

63
and maybe as I've gotten older, a little paternal sometimes

64
and jump on it but the nicest thing that was

65
ever said about me was by Alexandra Danilova,

66
the great Russian American Ballerina who said once,

67
Valtur, she calls me, "Valtur criticize, but never insult."

68
So that's my best review.

69
I would like to begin, though, and ask Ms. Chase

70
if she will just set the scene

71
and say what Ballet Theater began as, that was different

72
from any other company in the history of ballet.

73
Other than the fact that it was American,

74
what its basic concept was, that she wanted to share

75
and did indeed in the years to come. Lucia?

76
>> Well, that's quite. (laughs)

77
>> You can do it in five minutes

78
>> Yeah?
>> Oh sure.

79
>> All right, just five minutes.

80
But, it was a wonderful time

81
back in 1939 and actually I was in Mordkin Ballet

82
for two years before Ballet Theater

83
getting my experience and a young man,

84
a college man, came from the west coast and he was very

85
(microphone muffles)

86
and he wanted to help ballet

87
and he felt that it was time that

88
there was an American Ballet, that there was

89
the Mordkin Ballet, a Russian Fokine Ballet,

90
a Russian and many small companies.

91
But he wanted just the biggest thing he could get

92
absolutely an American company.

93
Now it didn't make any difference whether the dancers,

94
whatever nationality they were,

95
that had nothing to do with it.

96
It's just to get the best dancers.

97
So he asked Mordkin and Fokine.

98
He got a group that were interested in this

99
and I was a budding ballerina and I was in on it too

100
to know about it but I didn't know what

101
he was talking about at first.

102
Anyway, he did put together this company

103
and they're doing often now in the papers,

104
putting back what his dream of the company was.

105
It was to be an American big, marvelous company

106
with the best dancers that could be found.

107
No matter what size or shape,

108
although shape is very important.

109
(laughter)

110
So, yes, keep slim. (laughs)

111
But, so, we started at Mordkin and Fokine,

112
the two great Russian masters that were here.

113
They hadn't defected from Russia, they left

114
Russia long before with the revolution

115
or something like that I guess.

116
But anyway, I know Fokine came in 1919,

117
and so our wonderful Russians sitting with us,

118
they never saw Fokine as if he wasn't alive

119
or at least he wasn't in Russia.

120
So, and they don't know how wonderful it was

121
'til we grew up, Sallie and I, lots of people

122
and Leon with Mordkin and Fokine.

123
Now Mordkin was a very difficult man

124
and he really didn't care much.

125
So he was asked to choose the chord of ballet

126
with Fokine and Mordkin was this little.

127
Dancers over there, yeah, Fokine did the whole thing.

128
(laughter)

129
And Fokine was marvelous,

130
he was with us for two and 1/2 years before he died

131
and all after the first year and 1/2

132
of the Ballet Theater when it was out on the road

133
and in New York and everywhere.

134
And Fokine was wonderful.

135
So he did beautiful things for us and set Les Sylphides.

136
He even did a new ballet that year.

137
He hadn't done a new ballet for years,

138
but he got excited and he did a big ballet Bluebeard.

139
(laughing)

140
John Martin, the critic in New York, was the,

141
not exactly the pal of this one,

142
but they were the two big critics.

143
John Martin didn't like Bluebeard, and we went

144
to Russia in 1960 and we came back

145
and the Russians were crazy about Bluebeard.

146
That was their favorite of the whole repertoire we took.

147
So John Martin wrote, why didn't they leave it there?

148
(laughter)

149
He wouldn't do that, I'm sure.

150
>> I hear they filmed it and put it on there.

151
>> Did they?

152
I'm not surprised.

153
Yeah, I think I did hear that.

154
>> That's not plagiarism, that's research.

155
>> (laughs) Research.

156
>> Yes.

157
>> So we started in 1940,

158
and it's been going ever since 1940,

159
it's a marvelous company.

160
It's always been a very happy company.

161
And the dancers are all, and wonderful choreographers too.

162
We've all been a big family and we had a marvelous time,

163
and Ballet Theater crowd is always a family.

164
>> It is.

165
>> But we have a wonderful Rick Pleasant

166
who founded it, whose idea it was.

167
He got 11 choreographers together,

168
he got a Tudor from England

169
and he had different people from all over the world,

170
but he had 11 choreographers and we did 15 ballets.

171
We worked three months; October, November, December.

172
I guess, four months, and opened January 11th, 1940.

173
And we haven't been quiet since then.

174
>> That's right.

175
>> So it has a wide, the most diversified

176
repertoire of any company over here.

177
And that's why the people who defect

178
from the foreign countries they come to us

179
because they get a wider view,

180
and that's the only reason they leave.

181
It's not the country, it's just that they get

182
more experience and they can meet more choreographers

183
from the west and have a much broader effect.

184
Also they dance more often.

185
Those companies are too big,

186
they are about 250 in the company.

187
We're not up to 100 yet, but mighty near it.

188
But it's a wonderful company and going strong

189
we're going to, just down the west coast, Chicago,

190
San Francisco and Los Angeles,

191
and now we open at the Metropolitan New York

192
on the 19th of April for eight weeks.

193
And that'll be good we hope.

194
>> That wraps up the 42 years, doesn't it?

195
(laughter)
>> Yes, yes.

196
>> Ms. Chase was talking about why

197
the contemporary defectors like the American Ballet Theater

198
because of the diversification and the repertoire

199
which has always been one of its special attributes.

200
The first company to come to America in a remarkable

201
year of 1933 which is,

202
33, 34 is the Balanchine years.

203
The year that the San Francisco Ballet was founded.

204
It's the year that Catherine Littlefield founded

205
the Littlefield Philadelphia Ballet.

206
The Atlanta Ballet came into being and was the year

207
the Ballet Russe de Monte Carlo came to America

208
for the first time.

209
And Igor Youskevitch came to America,

210
not with the American Ballet Theater, but with the

211
Ballet Russe de Monte Carlo.

212
And I told Igor a few minutes ago,

213
I'd love for him, as an artist because he was

214
premier danseur with both companies

215
and did of course the classical repertoire

216
of Giselle and Swan Lake.

217
You may be happy to know in those days

218
Swan Lake was simply act two.

219
Nobody except a few historians knew

220
that there were three more acts.

221
We just thought, you know, she came on

222
with a lot of feathers, he fell in love with her,

223
and it all ended tragically very quickly,

224
and it doesn't anymore.

225
But Igor went from that company to Ballet Russe

226
with the classical works in the bridge versions and some

227
of their contemporary things that they did,

228
the great symphonic ballets of Massine,

229
and when he came to the American Ballet Theater

230
he still danced the classics but he also danced

231
some other roles in new ballets with new

232
kinds of movement and choreography.

233
So I'd like to ask Igor if he would tell us

234
what the transition was like for him

235
as a dancer from the Ballet Russe de Monte Carlo

236
to the American Ballet Theater.

237
>> Well, I would say it was quite easy

238
(laughter)

239
>> Quite easy.

240
>> But of course, there were some differences.

241
I always considered the Ballet Russe company

242
as a kind of traditional because most of them

243
were always consistent of dancers

244
with nationalities, without home.

245
And so, it's kind of immigrant type of ballet

246
and I always thought that they played a tremendous

247
and important part of course, in ballet in America.

248
But they were kind of a transition from the traditional

249
Russian ballet to American style type

250
home grown ballet.

251
And when I came to American Ballet Theater,

252
I had noticed the difference.

253
The company was existing only for about six years

254
when I came, I came for the sixth.

255
But because of the wide repertoire,

256
a lot of contemporary types of things,

257
it had a little effect on classical repertoire

258
in the sense of style.

259
It certainly did reflect the traditional classical ballet,

260
but it was more restrained and I in turn

261
was preforming more American style than

262
we were asked to do before.

263
Which I didn't mind a bit,

264
I just fell right into it.

265
(laughter)

266
What else can I say?

267
I believe that

268
the style I was accustomed to sometimes,

269
maybe in certain parts did not make much sense.

270
I felt that in American Ballet Theater,

271
the classics were kind of,

272
their paces were elliptical and the dramatic action

273
were more cordially placed.

274
It gave a little different outlook

275
with the old traditional ballet.

276
>> But more honesty as far as theater goes, then yeah.

277
Also, some of you may not know that among

278
the many new roles that Youskevitch did

279
was playing Stanley in A Streetcar Named Desire.

280
And I can remember when he was cast as that,

281
Lucia, everybody here the Prince of the ballet,

282
Erik Bruhn has written that he is ideal Prince the

283
danseur noble and that Erik himself said

284
he modeled his first Albrecht in Giselle after

285
Youskevitchs' and even when he matured,

286
saw no reason to change the basic concept.

287
So here was the prince of ballet,

288
all of a sudden in a dirty undershirt.

289
And instead of handling the ballerina like

290
a treasured, gentle, fragile, flower,

291
he was knocking her all over the place.

292
And did it extremely well,

293
I don't know whether he was getting back

294
after all these years.

295
>> I enjoyed it too.

296
>> And enjoyed it!

297
But also, if you've read your history,

298
you know that Nora Kaye,

299
who played opposite a minute at one performance

300
when he was about to,

301
what is the Victorian expression?

302
Have his way with her, and he lunged towards her

303
and she was doing this and she knocked him

304
out cold on stage.

305
(laughter)

306
And I remember talking to her afterwards about it

307
and she said, "I thought about hauling him to his feet,

308
"but that wouldn't do any good."

309
So she said, "I did the most erotic choreography

310
"ever invented over his prone body."

311
You don't, you don't remember that.

312
>> Yeah, in the last moments she had her own way with her.

313
>> With you.

314
(laughter)

315
So when he--
>> I was flat on the floor.

316
>> True!

317
Vulnerable weren't you?

318
So when Mr. Youskevitch said there was a change in

319
quality when he moved from Ballet Russe

320
to the American Ballet Theater, he was telling the truth.

321
I would like, just because the sequence is best,

322
to ask another one from the period Leon Danielian,

323
who danced also with both companies.

324
Did you notice the similar change as Igor did?

325
>> I agree very much with what Igor said

326
about the, there isn't that great change now.

327
I don't want to go off the subject

328
but I've read Igor's article in the New York Times

329
and there was the tendency

330
that happened about four or five years ago

331
with the American trained dancers

332
which all of you are,

333
were not trained well enough.

334
And I was brought up with a good library down the block.

335
And when the first defectors came,

336
Fokine was certainly one of them,

337
Mordkin, Ms. Chase's teacher and my teacher was another,

338
and people like Ladak whose brother was master

339
of the ballet at the Kirov went to London.

340
Fokine and Mordkin came to New York,

341
Neshinka still went to California.

342
Ladak and Madame went to London

343
and Jesenska went to Paris.

344
So this great curtain went around Russia

345
and the Americans trying to understand.

346
And I think so, I mean, I was pretty good too,

347
but we were well trained with a very good school

348
and ballet here was aware of that

349
and they formed a company that very well schooled people.

350
But suddenly from California came a young woman

351
of this great beauty called Nana Gourman.

352
She had one green eye here and one green here, enormous.

353
(laughter)

354
And I think bold, great artist

355
and the extensions went sky high too.

356
Her mission I think,

357
and many of the American dancers were wondering.

358
Well, that's what really impressed me

359
and the first day we were all grouped together,

360
how strong we were.

361
And I appreciate that article quite honestly

362
'cause it's so precise about the facts

363
of this strange team that was.

364
>> Those of you that missed it

365
in a recent Sunday New York Times,

366
there was an article by Mr. Youskevitch

367
and his analysis and appraisal of the dancing

368
of the classics today as distinct from what it once was

369
and what he felt was right.

370
I think it was a marvelous article

371
probably 'cause I agree with him, but it certainly was.

372
I'd like to ask the baby ballerina here, Sallie,

373
who has had a different performing experience

374
from either Youskevitch or Danielian

375
and that is she came to Ballet Theatre

376
when it was a well established company.

377
It had already made its own legends,

378
and Sallie had two things to do.

379
One, because she was superb and is, actress dancer

380
to her fell Rosse that had been created by Nora K,

381
for whom the term dramatic ballerina was invented.

382
And Sallie, followed her in such remarkable works

383
as Tudor spiller fire, which had been created for Nora.

384
She followed her in other particular roles.

385
In Fall River Legend, Agnes Camille's ballet

386
about Lindsey Boardman and The Murderous.

387
I mean, history says she didn't do the murder,

388
but Agnes found her guilty for ballet reasons.

389
And Sallie had to follow in those parts

390
and succeeded magnificently,

391
but it must have been difficult for her.

392
In addition, however, of course new roles were created

393
for her in contemporary ballets by Alvin Alley,

394
by Glenn Tedly, by many more.

395
So I'd like to ask Sallie, who was a comparative

396
late comer to the Americans Ballet Theater,

397
what it was like to follow in footsteps

398
as distinct from creating new parts.

399
>> And she also did create new parts.

400
>> This is not as difficult to create spare time.

401
>> It's not?
>> No.

402
Because I started in ballet and it was very violent,

403
of course, and I saw all those ballets

404
before I was ever in there, I loved those ballets.

405
And I still do things.

406
I knew the sound of Nora's feet on the floor.

407
It was so easy to learn about 'cause I already knew

408
the music and the sound of the feet,

409
which is how we learn and remember.

410
>> Yes.

411
>> And then I did other parts in the same ballet,

412
so I know the whole ballet inside and out.

413
And it wasn't difficult then to learn new parts.

414
>> Except that you created it

415
in your own way though.

416
>> I didn't do anything like Nora, or try to copy her.

417
But somehow, when I see the ballet,

418
I see Nora doing it, 'cause that's who I saw do it.

419
>> I see.

420
>> I've never seen me do it.

421
(laughter)

422
And so, if I--
>> You should have.

423
>> If I would embrace your passage or something

424
I would see Nora Kaye somewhere in my head,

425
see Nora as a model but I didn't think of copying her.

426
>> Yeah.
>> It's just the pattern,

427
that's brought in music.
>> Yes, the shape of it.

428
I'll take you to the movie some night

429
and you can see you in Pillar of Fire.

430
>> Okay.
>> You're marvelous.

431
There's a wonderful TV movie with Sallie Wilson

432
doing Pillar of Fire, and it really is brilliant.

433
So, what about new roles, which of course you're doing now.

434
Do you find that easier to start from scratch

435
of something you don't know at all.

436
>> Everything you do brand new.

437
If you're going to do it, just start doing it.

438
>> Yeah.

439
>> Hopefully, every performance.

440
>> Is a new one.
>> Yes.

441
>> Right.
>> It's a different

442
kind of thing to work on, have something made for you.

443
Because it's just right there what you got

444
and you see it take shape as you do it.

445
Where before you have an idea of what the shape is.

446
>> Did you feel as a dancer with the American Ballet Theatre

447
that Ballet Theatre had a style different

448
from other companies?

449
>> Oh, absolutely, yeah.

450
>> What was the key, from your dance point of view?

451
>> Can I change the subject?
>> Yeah.

452
>> The wonderful thing about American dancers

453
is that they come from everywhere,

454
from all different teachers.

455
And yet if you put them in the same ballet

456
and have learned the same ballet,

457
they have an adaptability to go together.

458
Because the style is less than the mannered

459
forced upon them style.

460
They learn dancing instead of style like pose.

461
And that's why it's difficult for training dancers

462
to do all ballets, because they can't get out

463
of the style that's been put on them.

464
>> Right.

465
>> And that's what I love about American dancers

466
and I always love that, and I'm going to cry.

467
(laughter)
>> That's marvelous.

468
Good.
>> Go ahead.

469
>> Can I ask Sallie a question?
>> Yeah, sure.

470
>> Didn't you play tennis with Martha Graham

471
and Bella?
>> Certainly.

472
>> Yes, can put boys and girls.

473
Forgive me, ladies and gentlemen should know that

474
the first time I saw Sallie dance

475
she was playing tennis with Martha Graham.

476
>> Now, that's crazy too.

477
>> That's the program not for us or something.

478
>> It was called Episodes.

479
>> Episodes.
>> That girl

480
and the lovely Aaron Piers. (laughs)

481
>> Well, Martha picked her and the tennis game

482
was a stylized battle between Queen Elizabeth,

483
not the present one, the earlier one,

484
and Mary Queen of Scots.

485
And for that it was just what Sallie is talking about

486
that you come as a dancer, not as a product

487
of a special school.

488
And so it was an early experiment in the mating

489
of modern dance with ballet,

490
and Paul Taylor danced with Balanchine

491
and Sallie danced with Martha Graham.

492
It's one of the best tennis matches you ever saw

493
in your life.
>> Yeah, I liked that.

494
>> You played tennis with Martha Graham.

495
>> That's nice.
>> That's so fun.

496
>> Yes.
(laughter)

497
And I want to turn now to Oliver Smith,

498
because Mr. Smith when he assumed the co-directorship

499
of the American Ballet Theatre with Lucia Chase

500
had been part of the company in this wonderful

501
creative process which has always brought together,

502
as Sallie was saying, talents from various origins

503
of, not only national, but state-wise

504
and in terms of the arts represented.

505
And one of the remarkable works which was done

506
by the American Ballet Theatre when it was Ballet Theatre

507
was Fancy Free which introduced an unknown choreographer

508
named Jerome Robbins, a comparatively unknown composer

509
named Leonard Bernstine and a very handsome

510
unknown young man named Oliver Smith.

511
Now, Oliver is and over these many years

512
has been a major figure in the theater of drama

513
and in music as well as dance.

514
And I think as long time co-director with Ms. Chase,

515
he can tell us today something about that side

516
of Ballet Theatre that has to do with the total image

517
of theatre that the company represented, it represents.

518
>> Well, first I'd like to say that

519
my great attraction probably actually began

520
quite a few years before I worked with it.

521
I worked with Ballet Russe.

522
And it was two ballets for them,

523
one was for Marcene and the second for Rodeo

524
which was Little Agnes.
>> Little Agnes, yeah.

525
>> When I first saw I was attending

526
the opening night of Ballet Theatre

527
at the Center Theater in 1940.

528
I was immediately impressed and amazed

529
by this whole new concept, it was very different.

530
As most Americans at that time they'd only been exposed

531
to Ballet Russe or Colonel Russian Ballet.

532
And this was as strikingly as Sallie imagined and Lucia,

533
and it had a totally different feel about it.

534
It was a very fresh approach of the classics too.

535
I was immediately attracted to, and I always follow

536
those performance with great interest.

537
But the opening of Pillar of Fire, which I had done,

538
in a sense affected my entire life.

539
With all of us at times, I think we hear certain composers

540
or hear certain great instrumentalists

541
or look at a certain painting.

542
But if we're creatively inclined, there are those moments

543
that occur which literally change our lives,

544
and the Pillar of Fire did.

545
It brought something to me in terms of dance and ballet

546
that I've never experienced before.

547
Other artists I would have experience level of choreography.

548
Martha Graham for example, he's changed with life,

549
and there are other choreographers.

550
So I felt very close to the company,

551
although I was simply a spectator.

552
And I became first associated with it

553
when I volunteered to do Fancy Free, I saw the job.

554
I mean, Pierre was doing his ballet

555
and I remember going to a rehearsal

556
and we all met at Pranapa House.

557
And he was, I looked through the door,

558
I looked at the rehearsal hall and I saw this

559
machine was choreographing and it was really

560
quite a dreadful ballet, it's called First Origins.

561
>> Oh, right, yes.
(laughter)

562
>> And it was receptive, Ballet Russe never

563
should have done it, but they did it anyway.

564
(laughter)

565
There was Lucia, hauled around the rehearsal

566
with a great red wig and she was--

567
>> She was a witch.
>> She was playing a witch

568
or something.
>> Yeah.

569
>> And that was the first time I ever saw Lucia.

570
And there was Jerome Robbins being hauled around

571
and he was sitting on this broom,

572
and he I'm afraid so, and a few others.

573
And they were being hauled around

574
this very splintered floor.

575
An actor who was over by Jerry got up

576
and run from behind and he was smiling rather rudely

577
and said, "Well, you're Oliver Smith, are you?"

578
And I said yes, he said,

579
"Well, it's pretty rough down there."

580
(laughter)

581
And that was my first meeting with Jerry

582
and then it was a very happy collaboration.

583
He didn't have a composer for his ballet

584
and I happened to know Lenny's work at Curtis

585
in Philadelphia and I was very impressed

586
with him as a student.

587
So I simply suggested and him as the composer.

588
And I think it was his first serious piece

589
of music that he'd written.

590
He'd done songs in night clubs intimately

591
and accompanied the Betty Comden and those people

592
on Village Cops, but he'd never done any serious composing.

593
So he wrote that score, of course we don't know

594
how remarkable it was and I had the good fortune

595
to design a setting for that ballet.

596
And through that I of course, met Lucia

597
on much more as part of the company.

598
And we've always been good, liked each other enormously,

599
respected each other very, very much.

600
And I got to know her family at Ballet Theatre

601
and it is a family, of course,

602
I think all ballet companies are.

603
I mean, Ballet Russe was a family too.

604
>> It's true.
>> Very much so.

605
But I got to know Nora, and of course Stu and Anthony,

606
and I felt very much a part of it.

607
And I also had the opportunity to design interplay

608
for Ballet Theatre and too on stage

609
for Mikhail.
>> Mikhail too.

610
>> And Wallace Kevin with Mr. Balanchine.

611
So by the time I had done that with ballet,

612
I really just was a part of the family

613
and was brought into the group.

614
And of course, later when Lucia and I

615
became director together,

616
I might mention to how that happened.

617
>> Yes, I wish you would.
(overlapping comments)

618
>> I think Lucia has always championed new choreography.

619
I mean, definitely one of her beliefs.

620
She was, of course, very influential in helping Tudor,

621
in supporting Tudor in Pillar of Fire.

622
And she was very important in the production of Fancy Free,

623
had always been one of her enthusiasm.

624
And when Lucia is enthusiastic,

625
she is very talented and she's very supportive,

626
she's very tenacious.

627
(laughter)

628
Those sorts of things that she supports

629
have a way of getting out.

630
And I'm tenacious too.

631
(laughter)

632
So together, I think it's however, formable.

633
(laughter)

634
But when we were having a certain conflict

635
with a very famous inforsario

636
and very remarkable man who was

637
chiefly interested in Russian ballet

638
and he was passionate about it, and he was Russian.

639
I think that we felt that the company,

640
and this has its ironic side too,

641
was becoming too Russian.

642
We wanted to also embrace the American choreographers,

643
American dancers.

644
Out of that conflict, I'm not doing all the details,

645
it would take an entire afternoon,

646
we assumed the direction so that we could have

647
the artistic control.

648
And we didn't think we would be doing it for so long,

649
I mean, it was going to be short.

650
(laughter)

651
We ended up in--
>> 35 years.

652
>> 35 years.
(Lucia laughs)

653
>> Short tenured, yes.

654
>> Excuse me.
>> Yeah.

655
>> Something I would like to say about Igor,

656
which I think he's enormously a modest man who can observe.

657
I think that what he did when he came into Ballet Theatre,

658
of course, is like all very great dancers

659
he brought with him his own great personal

660
sense of style as well as beauty and presence on stage here.

661
He was a very important star, one of the leading dancers

662
in the world actually, when it came to ballet.

663
And his arrival in the company, his presence in the company

664
actually had an enormous amount to do with coordinating,

665
what I would say, at that time

666
the classical style in the company.

667
And he brought wonderful qualities,

668
all the young dancers watched him very, very carefully.

669
Not only Eric Bruhm who's a support dancer,

670
he was and other dancers.

671
And he in a sense changed he whole males style

672
in that company and elevated it enormously.

673
And that was one of the, it helped impact a great deal

674
in developing the classical style variety.

675
>> Yes.

676
>> And there's no longer, his presence wasn't there.

677
So there was no focus that way.

678
And I think that he was very, very important

679
and we're very, very grateful to him,

680
that's why I'm here today.
(laughter)

681
>> Right.

682
He left not because he was angry with us,

683
but because he has a rehearsal.

684
But I know what Oliver Smith says is true

685
that young dancers watched him from the wings

686
and learned of his style because he was the finest

687
classical stylist of that time.

688
I don't think he had any equals at all.

689
And one of the other aspects that Ballet Theatre

690
benefited on, was his association

691
with the Cuban-American ballerina Alicia Alonso.

692
Because they became in the annals of ballet history

693
what Noshinky, Marko Vendolan,

694
they were in that great line of,

695
if I may use a good American expression

696
which Sallie would approve of, they were a great team.

697
A remarkable team that with Ballet Theatre

698
they danced together for 10 years,

699
and after that in guest appearances

700
another five years was added.

701
So that Igor, not only was a model

702
of the Premiere Dance soloist, but of the partner

703
of the actor of the Cavelier of the Gallant

704
and the relationship of the ballerina with the dancer.

705
It was a remarkable period in dance for them.

706
I think it would be a very good idea

707
for you out front if you would like,

708
since we have assembled here in honor of Igor Youskevitch,

709
people that span different periods from Ballet Theatre.

710
If you have any questions you'd like to address

711
to anybody on the panel, I'm sure they'd be delighted

712
to answer, if you would just stand up,

713
breathe from the diaphragm and say your question.

714
I can't see very well from here

715
because of these marvelous lights,

716
which I'm sure are terribly flattering to the ladies.

717
But if you do have a question please do ask it.

718
Oh, you're all so shy.
>> No.

719
>> Here's some.
>> Yeah, go ahead.

720
>> I'd like to address (inaudible).

721
>> No, I never did.

722
I don't think a critic can actually

723
because, at a given performance it's of the instant.

724
Since Sallie was talking about Pillar of Fire,

725
I'll mention that.

726
That was an unforgettable night in the theater,

727
the world premier of Pillar of Fire

728
when Nora Kaye really did become a star overnight,

729
something that you read about in magazines and books,

730
and it really happened.

731
And 27 curtain calls and all that,

732
and it was something that meant a great deal to me

733
because it was an adult ballet about adult people

734
and adult feelings.

735
And it was an example of Western Europe

736
as distinct from ballet in Russia

737
of getting away from fairy tales.

738
And not that we don't need them, God knows we need them,

739
but I had always wanted ever since I started

740
as a critic very young to have the public know

741
that even though dancing was diverting

742
it could also be stimulating and illuminating.

743
And if the drama could range from Afars to King Lear,

744
certainly the art of ballet could do the same thing.

745
Well, Pillar filled in that particular gap

746
at that particular night and it was just marvelous.

747
And so, for that moment, that was the most important thing

748
that ever happened to me.

749
And yet, conversely when the Settlers Wells Ballet

750
opened in New York and Margo Fontaine

751
came running on to the stage as protected Princess Aurora

752
and smiled at the audience and then stood on that

753
ridiculous pedestal which is her own toe shoe,

754
while everybody worshiped her.

755
That too was another miracle for me in the art of dancing.

756
So I couldn't possibly pick any one moment,

757
because they're all the great ones are extremely important.

758
I will tell you after seeing, I once saw

759
five Swan Lakes in two and a half days, and that was a hell

760
of a lot of Tchaikovsky in feathers to put up with.

761
(laughter)

762
And I was about ready for Martha Graham

763
going into one of her mazes.

764
But after two weeks of Martha Graham being Domiga,

765
I'm ready for the Radio City Hall Rockettes.

766
So the thing is I love every kind of dancing

767
that you can possibly think of, if it's good.

768
I just wish I was there that time in 1793,

769
Alexandra Plassi did a horn pipe on a tight rope

770
while playing the violin and displaying

771
the American flag in various attitudes.

772
I would have loved that too.

773
But to answer your question, if for the moment is the best

774
that's my favorite, but only for that moment.

775
Do we have some more.

776
Lucia, you are very good at seeing.

777
>> It helped.
>> Yes.

778
>> Well, that's right.

779
(laughter)

780
>> Oh, for Ms. Chase.

781
(inaudible)

782
>> We'll meet you back stage.

783
(laughing and clapping)

784
>> I'll only say one thing,

785
that when Misha came in, just a year ago

786
and Misha is wonderful, he's most attractive on stages,

787
he's got a terrific charm and he's great.

788
But, I'm probably saying, should I say this?

789
>> Why not?

790
>> Well, all right, why not?

791
You won't tell on me, if you should.

792
Well, I was the most surprised person in the world

793
when Mr. Krivates, he was under Donald Kendall.

794
Donald Kendall said, "God bless him,

795
he is head of the Ballet Gillad Foundation

796
and he gets the money for us and he's marvelous."

797
But Emma asked me Donald would like to see me

798
and I couldn't drive, I said, ooh.

799
He said, "Would you like your lawyer there?"

800
And I said, "Not if I see him alone."

801
If you're going to be there I'll take my lawyer.

802
(laughter)

803
And when he asked me I said, well,

804
ooh I hadn't thought of that.

805
I said, you must get a successor so what's the hurry?

806
(laughter)

807
So I wasn't very good,

808
but I was perfectly willing, but I said

809
that tour is not my vocabulary.

810
Either retire or resign.

811
So, I moved over and it couldn't have been nicer to me,

812
I stick around, I have a motto.

813
(laughter)

814
A smile on my face and keep my mouth shut,

815
and it works very well.

816
I have a wonderful car.

817
(laughter)

818
>> And as Mr. Smith says, she is tenacious.

819
(laughter)

820
>> And this is the last season I went with--

821
(inaudible)

822
And I went back stage to say hello to the crew.

823
And I walked down the hall, through the door

824
down the hall to the stage and there was

825
(inaudible) with yellow papers in their hands.

826
(laughter)

827
And it was exactly the same to you.

828
>> But I don't interfere.
>> No, no!

829
>> Do you have another question?

830
(laughter)

831
>> I have.
>> Oh good.

832
(inaudible)